Posted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject: Due November 3
Write at least 100 to 200 words reflecting on the reading responding to these questions or the questions of your peers. Please include at least one question in your post.
Why do you think people have a hard time pinning down a "third wave"? Was there a third wave? What lead to new forms of activism in the 80s and 90s?
Why do you think people have a hard time pinning down a "third wave"? Was there a third wave? What lead to new forms of activism in the 80s and 90s?
First post! woohoo!
First off, I thought that the assignment was to read the whole chapter, so i read to page 126... I think that people have a very hard time pinning down a "third wave" because it's so recent in our history. Hindsight is 20/20, but since we are still in the "third wave" and nothing that can compare to the first or second waves has happened yet- i think that people are hesitant to give this movement a name yet. Also, many women nowadays don't consider themselves "feminist," even though they agree with many feminist views because they associate feminism with being butch, unwomanly, and have hairy legs.
QUESTION: Why was there was a sudden change between feminism being okay to feminism being a bad thing, that many knew little about?
p.s. Martha- can i suggest that the link for the forum to be put in "links" on under the "links" section of the individual homework every night? i haven't memorized the address and it's a new month so the listing from it from last month disappeared... (that or maybe just not have forums anymore? yes? Thanks, Liza.)
I definitely agree with Liza's points. Good Job! I also think that because the "third wave" is so recent it is difficult to pin down dates and specific events that are important to this phase of the women's movement. We can see that certain groups have emerged over the past 20 or so years that have not had much of a voice before. For example, the LGBT community develops more of a voice in the third wave fighting for LGBT rights as well as groups devoted to responding to the AIDS epidemic. Other women's groups popped up here and there with more focused goals as well. Some examples of these were the Guerrilla Girls, Pro-sex and Anti-sex feminists, Womanists (a group for black feminists), ecofeminists, and EMILY (not Schneider!) which were groups focused on specific kinds of women's rights.
Other forms of activism taking place in the 80's and 90's were groups that were against women's rights. Anti-abortion groups such as Operation Rescue used fear as their main tactic. Operation Rescue in particular became famous for their violent tactics which included harassment and violence towards women seeking abortions, people who worked in abortion clinics, and doctors who provided abortions. These groups came around in the 80's and 90's as a result of the conservative backlash.
I guess my question would be...
What are some of the new tactics that are used in third wave feminism? Why are they successful or unsuccessful?
I completely agree with what Liza said about the third wave, how people have a hard time pinning it down because it’s still happening. I also think it’s hard because the issues that the third wave feminists were/are fighting for were kind of continuations of issues from the second wave, like abortion rights and job/equal pay rights. I think some people think these issues are already solved; actually, it was made very clear in the “Backlash” packet that some people did/do think that. (Side question for Martha-when was “Backlash” written? )
It’s pretty surprising how much of a backlash there was after the 70s. Women had made so much progress in terms of political and personal rights and freedom, and then suddenly everything started going down hill in women’s rights. I was amazed about the extent of the backlash; like antiabortion activists murdering doctors that performed abortions-that was really extreme.
Another aspect of the backlash that surprised me was how the whole idea of personal is political began to die out. In Dicker it said “Instead or relying on collective action, the women interviewed for the article believed that inequality should be addressed on an individual level…” (108). I think that the idea of personal is political was a very strong and important part of the women’s movement, and it was something that united women and made them talk to each other. The fact that this concept began to fade is upsetting, because it shows how bad the backlash really was.
To answer Meg’s question, the third wave feminists used some of the same tactics as the second wavers, such as the Guerilla Girls who used surprising images, slogans and humor to catch the attention of the public, and this worked really well for them. Another tactic was that women started groups and programs that supported women who needed help with abortions and sexual abuse, which were really helpful to women in need, but also created controversy and were an incentive for antiabortion people to act up . Also, at the very end of the reading in Dicker it talked about women punk rock musicians who used music as a tactic to fight for women’s rights, which I think is really cool.
My question is: Why do you think there was such a huge backlash and why did it get worse kind of after the second wave ended rather than during it?
The answer to the first part of the question was directly addressed in the text: "...the third wave is occurring right now; it is often hard to see outside of the history we are living." This has always happened in history: it is difficult to have a good view of what is happening through the eyes of an insider.
One of the highlights of this wave of movement was the issue concerning abortion. The election of Ronald Reagan in 1980 and the rise of the New Right seriously threatened the achievements of the second wave of the women's movement. "As a result of the Hyde Amendment, poor women no longer could afford abortions; indeed, access to abortion became as
linked to economic status as it had been in the days before Roe." The conservative policies opposing women's right of abortion of Reagan's administration became part of the motivation of the third wave.
Another notable change in the third wave was the increasing participation of women of color through writings. They officially and strongly raised their voice "to examine incidents of tolerance, prejudice and denial of difference within the feminist movement". Along with this came the foundation of the Guerrilla Girls, whose concerns were about gender discrimination in the art world. (I think that the fact that the organization comprised of artists, writers, performers, and filmmakers represented a stronger form of activism).
One can not talk about the third wave without noting the Thomas-Hill controversy since it actually ignited an "official declaration" on the beginning of the Third Wave. Since it was involved with the injustice that women had to experience at workplaces (places where they had tried really hard to get in), it reproved some of the arguments of the feminism's opposers in Backlash by Susan Faludi indicating that women had "made it". Because of this event, 1992 became "Year of the Woman".
Question: How differently were the women in the third wave divided from that in the first and second waves?
Why do you think people have a hard time pinning down a "third wave"? Was there a third wave?
I completely agree with Liza and Meg's answers to this question, but I think there's other piece. As I understand, the first wave of feminism "ended" when the activism seemed to fade. Decades later, feminist activism became much more visible, and activists had sort of reorganized. Feminists in second wave used different strategies and tactics than they did in first wave. I think one reason it's so hard to pin down when and what the third wave was is that, in a lot of ways, the initiatives presented by the second wave are still relevant. The second wave hasn't completely died down. Also, many of the strategies feminists are using now are the same as strategies used in the second wave. The "third wave" isn't different enough from the second wave to be declared it's own wave. Heres my question:
What do you think makes the third wave different from the second wave? What changed and what didn't?
I think people had a hard time pinning down a third wave because there were some topics that were related to the first and second wave like in the first half of the chapter, some topics that were already introduced before was equality between men and women and ending of discrimination between white middle class women and colored women and abortion. Also, they mentioned that women were being paid a lot less than men and in the backlash packet, they said how the freedom of women made everything worse but only 8 percent of women agreed with this. I think there was a third wave but no one thought of it as a third wave because women thought some of the topics were unimportant because they had nothing else to argue against. The new topics introduced were HIV that led to AIDS and they believed that gay men and lesbians had it and they didn’t care about them until they chained themselves to a building in New York.
What was the goal of the group they created called EMILY?
So I am going to jump on the band wagon in saying that it is hard to define the third wave seeing as it is mid movement. Some one said that it is really easy to analyze history seeing as it is concrete. History cannot change whereas this movement or lack thereof could take a turn for the best or worst, something seemingly unimportant can later be define as a pivotal point. I think that the key to it is that we just do not know yet. I always find it interesting to think about what moments will be defined as pivotal. I do not feel as if I have much to say about the movement or the reading. I do not know if I see such a movement today, I think there is an underlying theme of gender equality, racial equality and such, but I would hardly say I see any movements in any aspect. I am curious whether women of the 60s and 70s felt this way. We see such a romantisized image of the 60s and 70s, but I am curious as to whether it looked all that dissimilar to now.
In people's interviews did they see that their candidate found the whole the whole thing to be rather normal at the time? because I never asked Anne this, I more just got that idea. Seeing as she never said it though I cannot be too sure.
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Thanks, Liza.)
